I received an email over the weekend from Jennifer Round of Gerroa Newsagency, Post Office and General Store – a coastal town located around 90 minutes from Sydney. The local council says it will fine them $10,000 every time there is a complaint about the noise associated with wrapping newspapers early in the morning. Jennifer’s own words best describe the situation:
The business and residence is combined with a vacant block to one side and a property to the other with a cliff at the back. The house next-door to us is used during holiday periods.
In February 2007 a neighbouring newsagent gave up there newspaper territory and we took it on and unlike others we are actually making money from it.
However, the increase in work re wrapping papers, trucks arriving in the night, vehicles in and out of the driveway in the we hours have lead to a neighbour lodging a noise complaint. We were a little annoyed since the complaint is from a semi part time neighbour who never came in and saw us just filled a complaint with the council whom are now threatening to issue us with fines if we do not cease operations.
We are in the process of tying to reduce the noise as best we can. We have striped the garage and have lined the walls and roof with insulation have relined the walls with noise reduction plasterboard. Have laid rubber mates on the floor and will laid some on the walls in an effort to reduce the noise of the wrapping machine which seems to be the issue of the complaint.
We are after other ideas we have contacted an acoustic engineer whom has quoted us $10,000 in improvements however they aren’t able to say that after all that work it will make too much of a difference.
We do not have anywhere else to wrap the papers. We have looked at other locations in neighbouring towns but still have the same issues we have at the moment commercial/industrial properties surrounded by residential properties. It would also be unprofitable to move.
We are wondering if any other Newsagency have had issues with noise complaints from neighbours, businesses and alike. Moreover, if they have how have they managed it.
If we are not able to work something out it looks like our doors will be closing not because of hard economically times but because of our local council who are more interested in fining us up to $10,000 for each complaint than finding a solution that will benefit the community as a whole.
As Jennifer says, if you have suggestions, please post comments here.
I would pass all council correspondence on to the publishers. It is them, after all, that require the papers to be wrapped.
Hi Jennifer
a) Acknowledge councils letter asap which will show that you are serious in resolving this issue and share with them that any fine you receive will mean business closure. Ask them to work together with you. Including what you have done already, include what Shayne has suggested,
b) Obtain support from your local MP.
c) The delivery contracters can drop the papers of in a drop box outside of the complex . I use that method.
d) Good luck and let us know how you go.
Hi Jennifer,
The suggests from Shayne and Derek are good. The only thing I can add is the following: Work with council, acknowledge their letter. Maybe suggest to them that you would like to work with them in an attempt to resolve the matter otherwise you will file an application in the Land and Environment Court for a determination. You can represent yourself. Cost you a couple of hundred dollars to file. More likely than not they will hold a hearing in an informal manner at your premises and make a determination. I have recently been through the process myself re a home improvement with success.
http://www.lawlink.nsw.gov.au/lec
Hi Derek.
Have replied to the council’s letter have had them out here have and still will continue to show them what we are doing have documented all work along with photos quotes from acoustic engineer, roller shutter people etc.
The council arent interested in helping us out forget the fact this shop has been serving the community for over 70 years it just doesnt fit into the council’s last local environment plan they would rather we werent here and couldnt really care about the impact that will have on the local community.
Im not in a complex im a stand alone store surrounded by residental housing. I am zone commerical however the council is treating me as I am zoned residental. But are more then happy to charge me commerical land rates.
Any other ideas people have would be helpful even if you think its outrageously silly it might just be the answer.
Thanking you in advance
Jennifer
I’d tell some of your customers whats happening, and how the town will lose this service. You never know what good ideas or contacts you may get.
If your in that zone, I can’t see what the council are trying to do.
I remember when they would have the Sandown 500 at Sandown, Melbourne. Over thirty years suburbia grew around it but when the race was on, a lot of new residents complained about the noise.
It was there first, if your Newsagency is 70 years old I’d say to the owner complaining “Why buy it in the first place if you knew we were here?”
Jennifer, I am not sure which wrapper you have but with the Ronai you can get a kit that works with a compressor…it lowers the sound of the machine considerably. Maybe someone who has this modification will ad to this.
Hi Baz
Its a DK Carter newswrap
At the moment we are having cushions made that we can put on the outside to see if that makes a reduction in the noise its producing.
A handful customers are aware of the issues we are having and have offered several ideas cant say all are legal however.
The neighbour who has made the complaint is typically only down in the summer and easter holidays but have no problems buying items from us when they are down.
Hi Jennifer,
So is the complaint made only by this one neighbour and no one else in the vicinity?
Is your early morning activity disturbing his/her sleep?
I would suggest perhaps they move to another room furthest from your activity area.
Or if you have done all this noise reduction measures and it still does not satisfy him/her, have you looked into perhaps double glazing their property instead and make their house sound proofed like those houses within vicinity of airports.
There’s no way you can insulate external sounds from trucks coming/going onto your driveway making deliveries. so there will still be complaints from this sector.
I would say doing something to their house, making it sound-proofed from external noise would be the way to go. It would cost you but at least this way the onus is on them to respond to your resolution.
Good Luck…..
What about fencing like the kind used along the highways and freeways to reduce road noise? Is that an option?
Hi Wendy
We have asked the council if we can but a wall along the broundary so the noise bounces back into use. They said no cause it will block there sunlight. Then we asked if we could use those glass bricks to build a wall therefor allowing light though the councils reply was no.
Cant say im dealing with a helpful council.
Hi Bario
Have gone around looking where else we can wrap its only a small shop with an even smaller residence attacted. Have shown the council and explained why the wrapping is done where it is.
We would be more then happy to work with the complaining neighbour however they complain about every neighbouring property to them. If they where a full time neighbours and not here for a handful of weeks out of the year. Sound proofing there place might be an option. We have approched them and offered to buy there property but they declined.
Please keep sending those ideas though.
Thanking you in adavance
Jennifer
Then I would say you need a good lawyer as it seems the council is not on your side to mediate with the neighbour or see reason.
Given that it seems you have done all you can to abate the issues even down to buying over their property,(obviously price is an issue here as you could not be held at ransom) it looks like they do not want you there at all.
This neighbour must have known when they bought the place that it’s next to a newsagency business and that they would encounter these early morning activities.
I really don’t what else to say except that these sort of people are just not meant to co-exist in this world at all!
I still see soundproofing their property as the way to go. Have you approached both the council and this neighbour about it?
If they still do not agree to this, then it would mean they are not interested in any solution at all but to throw you out of the neighbourhood.
Jennifer,
When all commonsense suggestions and efforts on your behalf fail – go straight to A Current Affair – do not pass go and do not collect that $200.00
Let the world see what simple minded idiots control your local council. Get ACA to ‘out’ your neighbour as well – GO TO WAR GIRL
It might be cheaper to hire/purchase a shed in a nearby commercial area and do your wrapping over there.
While all my ideas have been already been proposed, I am reminded of a similiar situation in my town a few years ago.
A local developer had proposed a tavern in a residential area on a site that had previously been a small park, 3 tennis courts and a toilet block.Predictably, some residents opposed the development and several years of court cases followed.
In the end, the development was approved and was built.In the first week that the tavern was open, a group of the vocal opposition decided to have dinner and a few quiet drinks there.The publican, who was also the developer, let them know in no uncertain terms that they were not welcome and never would be and had security escort them from the premises!
I suggest that once this issue is resolved, you adopt a similiar stance.I have lived in small communities and well remember how easily outsiders causing trouble can be frozen out…….food for thought…..
Jennifer, I’m sorry you are having these problems. As a Newsagent and a elected Councillor (not yours I’m afraid) I am only to aware of difficulties when working with some Council staff. I would suggest speaking with your Councillors who can liaise with the Councils General Manager thus bypassing staff. If you get a sympathetic ear you may strike it lucky. You can also request that it go before full Council at the Council meeting. Good luck.
Jennifer,
I would be looking for the original DA for the garage, or the documentation from council that approved the use of the garage for commercial activity. There may be something in these that acknowledges the noise, truck movements, etc and approves a certain level of noise, or a certain time frame in which the activity can occur. If there is no such documentation I dare say you won’t have much of a legal argument. But nonetheless, I would get legal advice.
I think your being bluffed by the council, bigtime. No council in Australia can fine you for noise. It’s the EPA that do that.
Also, your neighbour would have to be given a sound meter(some councils supply these) to record sound levels and keep a record. You can’t be the only one who keeps a log.
I wouldn’t expend any money on sound deadening until you get proper legal advice. Again, your council would have great trouble enforcing their will through the court’s. And, if you’re the only one taking notes regularly, all the more advantage to you.
Dare say your council admin’ would be called needlessly antagonistic by a judge.
Is the machine louder than a Harley-Davidson?
I think John Kirkham’s right, we’ve had to use a special sound recorder once to monitor road works.
Maybe ask the council to put in a device to work out if it is in fact in breach?
And I wouldn’t be serving THAT customer anymore, but I’d give them a serving though.
John,
Councils can fine for noise. See http://www.environment.nsw.gov.au/noise/neighbourhoodnoise.htm
Encountered similar problems with a block of flats out the back of my newsagency. We used to run the machine outside.
We now run the machine inside a storeroom. Got some battered supermarket trolleys. Delivery staff wheel them up a ramp and close the door behind them while wrapping. The storeroom is brick with concrete floor and wooden door. The sound is reduced to almost nothing when the door is closed. The noise is significant if the door is open. This is only a very small room but the system works surprisingly well.
Do you have a suitable ‘solid’ room that can suppress noise? Tin sheds are useless. Walls along the property line are expensive and likely ineffective.
Alternatively find a local business eg car mechanic, warehouse, tyrefitters who might let you use their property as an early morning base for a couple of hundred bucks a month (plus a free paper).
Hi Jennifer
In a previous life one of my roles was that of policing noise regulations, this was 12+ years ago so things may have changed a little but the basic principles will remain the same. In WA we operated under delegated authority from the EPA and Council could take legal action if it so chose (incidentally it never did, and most do not, because of the complex nature of noise), so it may be the same in NSW.
Noise “pollution” is very difficult to prove because it is so subjective and can be highly emotive, and once the complainant is aware of the noise, even the slightest noise emanating from your premises may spark a complaint regardless of whether or not the noise is unreasonable. Typically noise measurements need to be averaged over a significant period of time for them to have relevance, the longer the period the more significant the readings. If you have high peak readings, such as would be made by something banging, then this would not help your cause. Low frequencies are far more difficult to “keep in” than higher frequencies, and also travel a lot further. Council may also have the power to confiscate the equipment that is making the noise so this is also worth taking into account.
I would suggest that you engage a sound engineer to do an evaluation on your business and measure the actual noise emanating and then relate these to the statutes in NSW. From the sounds of it the Council is bullying you and as I say it is a lot of work, and technically quite complex, for them to be able to make a determination that you are in breach of the law. They cannot simply fine you because they think that you are making too much noise, they need hard evidence in the form of Sound Pressure Level (SPL) readings over an extended period of time and then need to relate this to the natural background noise that is present when you are not operating.
Ask them what SPL readings they have (should be in dB(A) as this is the weighting applied for human hearing) and by how much it is in breach of the requirements. Basically SPL doubles every 3dB(A) so 60 dB(A) is twice as loud as 57 dB(A). Again, I strongly suggest that you engage a sound engineer/consultant that can do a report that you can present to Council to show that either you are not in breach, or if you are then what you can do to fix it. It will help to have someone on your side that understands sound/noise. I would do this before doing anything else.
Good luck
Hi….
Just a thought. In most towns you can lease storage sheds for very cheap…people use these when they are going away or are renting and don;t have room etc….i have had a quick browse at about $10/week in my area….you could be based here each morning with nothing around to hear you except empty sheds.
Hi Daniel
Have looked at the storage sheds in a neighbouring town however they have a time restriction on them no noise from 6pm until 6am makes it hard when we start wrapping around 2am
Hi Cameron
Im in a small coastal village with an average population of 500 people theres no eg car mechanic, warehouse, tyrefitters. Theres a cafe, club, kiosk’s and myself.
I would like to thank everyone for all there feed back. Several points that have been raised im going to look into tomorrow
If there are any other ideas im happy to here them
Thanking you in advance
Jennifer Round
It is terrific to see so much positive and respectful engagement on this issue.
Jennifer,
Back to the wrapper silencer, give Tim a call at 0260252588 in Albury, he has one of these things fitted and the noise reduction is substantial. Call around 7am today if poss.
My machine is old and noisy, but I dont have complaints. I have noticed when I service my machine, that the noise level drops dramaticly when I run it without the front and side sheet metal covers on it. If I ever I did get a complain, this is the first place I would start. Replace them with perspect, mesh or even line the inside with rubber to stop the echo and vibration noise. Take them off and give it a run, be carefull, and be surprised.
Hi Danny
Yes to stop that echo. The machine is lined in a rubber foam matting. While it is quiter without the shell on its becomes a ohas issues. We have found by stripping cushions around the outside of the shell has reduced some of the noise.
Again I would like to thank everyone for there ideas, thoughts and comments.
Yours Truly
Jennifer
Jennifer,
I can remember hearing on ABC Radio about a case where residents wanted to close Luna Park down because of the noise. I thought that the point that won the case for Luna Park was that the park was there well before the residents who were complaining. They bought into the area knowing what it was like. Maybe that could be a precedent for your case to the council.
Good Luck.
Come on guys, there is two sides to every story. The same argument could be used in reverse. They knew residences were nearby, so why take over a newsagent in the area that is going to produce noise in the first place? Excessive noise DOES make people’s lives miserable. All you have to do is ask yourselves if you would like to live next door to the noise that you make? If the answer is no, well……..Good on you for trying to fix it up though.
Hello Jennifer,in SA we are looking at
flat wrap for paper delivery and the Advertiser is already using it for some areas. There is no machinery needed as they arrive from the publisher already flatwrapped.
I don’t know where you are but maybe you could offer to be a “guinea pig” for flat wrap in your area if this idea is going to be a national initiative. e.g. the News Ltd Publications are obviously looking at it.
Can anyone help where I can get the Ronai news paper wrapping machines? Manufacturer or distributor. Thanks